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History of Westeros • View topic - "jon Snow" really dead?? Actor confirms? Possible spoilers

"jon Snow" really dead?? Actor confirms? Possible spoilers

Anything goes, so beware of spoilers.

Re: "jon Snow" really dead?? Actor confirms? Possible spoile

Postby SerKnute » Wed Jun 17, 2015 1:53 pm

Ha! That does have a wolfish outline to it huh? I had a thought in my head when I saw it that made me think of the Targaryen Sigil, Red on Black (Jon's Blacks and his Blood) but I don't think it's anything more than just my eyes and brain. Also the way it was shot with the darkness and all it felt to me like it was almost black and white, I couldn't see colors easily distinguished. I think the Wolf 'symbolism' if that's the right word is more applicable here than my thoughts or allusions that it might be symbolizing the dragon.
Edd, fetch me a block.
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Re: "jon Snow" really dead?? Actor confirms? Possible spoile

Postby AmbiguousProphecy » Wed Jun 17, 2015 1:55 pm

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Re: "jon Snow" really dead?? Actor confirms? Possible spoile

Postby jom » Wed Jun 17, 2015 2:47 pm

I re-watched the ending and the photo I posted is correct (not photo-shopped) but it goes by so fast it could be just an illusion...frozen in time so to speak. I'm not sure there is anything to it.....oh well.

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Re: "jon Snow" really dead?? Actor confirms? Possible spoile

Postby AmbiguousProphecy » Wed Jun 17, 2015 6:08 pm

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Re: "jon Snow" really dead?? Actor confirms? Possible spoile

Postby mcmnky » Thu Jun 25, 2015 12:37 pm

There are two questions, what do you think will happen? And what do you hope will happen?

The answer to both should be, Jon is dead and will stay dead.

I agree all the foreshadowing, in both books and show, with Mel at the wall, the questions around Jon's parentage, and the status of Jon as a character. To that last point, for all the talk of GRRM's willingness to kill off major characters, no one on that level has been killed off. With Jon, we're talking Tyrion, Arya, Dany level character. Of the dead characters, Cat comes close, but not quite. Ned, Robert, Joffrey, Robb, Oberyn, etc. were never that major.

Back to Jon, what of all the R +L = J speculation? Supposedly the identity of Jon's mother is so important to understanding the series that the answer to that one question convinced GRRM that D&D were the right people to adapt the books.

But, what are the books about? What is GRRM's goal with this series? Isn't about subverting tropes? Isn't about challenging our expectations? Isn't this series about not following the same old cliches?

So let's look at Jon and R + L = J. Here we have an orphan, a bastard hated by his step-mother. Who turns out to be a prince and savior of the kingdom. I mean, if R + L = J is true, then a living Jon Snow is _the_most_important_man_in_Westeros_. Bastard to King. Cinderfella. Could there be a conclusion to Jon's story that is more cliche, more Disney, more trite?

I've enjoyed the books and the HBO show, but Jon coming back to save to save the day takes what could be an exemplary work of art and relegates it to be just some very well written fantasy fiction.

Yes, there is much in the series that points to Jon being a character too big to die. And certainly he's been in situations where it seemed only plot armor saved him. But at this point, for Jon to be saved from the clutches of death and turn into a great hero is so expected it would be boring.
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Re: "jon Snow" really dead?? Actor confirms? Possible spoile

Postby jom » Wed Jul 08, 2015 4:24 pm

mcmnky: You make good points but there really is only ONE problem. There is literally NO ONE left in the north to move the story along in terms of the "big" character you mention. I mean, if it's the "Song of Ice and Fire" who or what is "Ice"? The running joke on the podcast now is that Ramsey is the "savior" of the north! That would certainly subvert tropes wouldn't it?

I believe as I have since I read DoD that Jon will indeed come back otherwise you really have no story...at least in the north you don't. That and you would have wasted all that time developing Jon's background.....which BTW they hinted at in the TV show and the TV show does NOT have the time to waste due to budget. And not only Jon's origin but all that set-up at Hardhome was directly pointed to Jon. Again, why would a TV show waste screen time for that?

Although, I hear what you are saying I just don't buy it. There's more to a story than just trying to circumvent past ideas in literature. You have to have a STORY first and foremost.

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Re: "jon Snow" really dead?? Actor confirms? Possible spoile

Postby GeekFurious » Tue Jul 28, 2015 2:46 am

While they could certainly pull off a season without Jon... I just don't see it happening unless they plan on introducing the characters they've so far skipped.
Sometimes you write a story that goes where, as a member of the audience, you wouldn't want it to go. Because anything else would be dishonest.
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Re: "jon Snow" really dead?? Actor confirms? Possible spoile

Postby KimberBenton » Sat Aug 01, 2015 8:31 am

If Jon is not dead, they have to put him into season 6 for many reasons, one is, that Kit is on demand right now, he will not sit around and wait for a year. I believe they had this same decision made with Alfie Allan. They have him constantly on the show, while he is not in books 3+4, Theon, not Alfie :)

Also, if they don't want him to be dead, they should bring him back, or they lose a lot of viewers (not the fans, but the casuals, since he is a fan-favorite). If he is dead, they just have to live with that.
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Re: "jon Snow" really dead?? Actor confirms? Possible spoile

Postby Booze » Mon Sep 14, 2015 11:34 pm

Kit: The important thing is that I now know exactly how long I am still under contract, and in the meantime-

Interviewer: How many more seasons would that be?

Kit: Nice try (laughs). I can’t talk about that. Let’s just say that Game of Thrones will remain a part of my life for a while, I’ll probably be in my thirties when it’s over. One thing’s for sure: the day I’m no longer on Thrones is the day I’ll bury myself in movie projects (laughs).
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